TROUBLE IS PEEKING THROUGH THE WALL FOR SEASON 2! - AOT #25

Are you watching the ova episodes?

Yea, that's just beyond cruel! :-)

Spaz Boys Comedy

:-D

Spaz Boys Comedy

Why do I need to pause to read them when, so far, I haven't had a problem reading them in real time?

Spaz Boys Comedy

To put it in perspective: They basically used a nuke within their own territory to take out ONE terrorist and they know there are more out there. At this rate, they'll render themselves extinct in order to take out what could be one small terrorist group. As you can imagine, they aren't in a celebrating mood and view the guy who detonated the nuke as a monster. Sure, they might have saved some lives in the long run but in the moment, you can only think about the lives you lost.

Miasimon

YES Please!!!

Nuptup

Yes and someone else is Dio, very fitting actually

Gigamac24

I believe the reason why the people in the show don't value the capture of Annie as much as you do Curtis is because for them all that was accomplished was they only stopped 1 of but many threats and learned that other sentient titans besides the colossal and armored exist and may even have already infiltrated their ranks. And I'm sure they are all well aware that there are probably more titans like the female titan out there and they can't afford to keep losing the amount of losses suffered with Annie every time a new sentient titan appears. In order to shift the tides in their favor they need to learn something new that can be used against the titans and they had hoped that by capturing Annie they would accomplish that, yet nope. To them the appearance of Annie was a huge set back and with her neutralized they have only managed to get back to where they were before Annie appeared, at the cost of countless lives. So capturing Annie to them isn't a step forward it's a step back to where they were before. Also it's easier to look on the bright side when you are a viewer and not the one in that actual situation, humans for the sake of survival naturally tend to see the negatives more so that they focus more on fixing the negatives.

Skywing217

The thing with the operation being mostly a failure is simply that the methods used and the lives lost do not outweigh the loss of human life. Humanities SURVIVAL has been everyone's greatest concern for the past century, as they could never really fight against the titans before. Most people work on the 'minimize casualties' mindset at this point, while Erwin and to a point Armin work on the 'victory at all costs' mindset. Which true, CAN get shit done, but also raises the question is it worth saving humanity if most of it is gonna be dead before its saved? Going between those two points of view on the titan issue is what the series balances around a lot. Also just to clarify, that was a titan INSIDE the wall, not the Colossal one appearing behind it. Which raises many questions in and of itself, how did it get in there? whats it doing there? ect

Lewd Angel

Number 1 makes no sense, they didn't know she could entomb herself in the crystal therefore they couldn't have predicted they wouldn't be able to get any info out of her, so just jumping to the conclusion they should kill her would make no sense

Lewd Angel

Decided to catch up to your reactions(Was going to binge them, but changed my mind) Glad to see you're enjoying the show and yes, Mikasa is amazing and a badass.

DevilJynx

Reasons this plan is a failure overall: 1. They sacrificed all of this lives to take her alive for interrogation. If they weren’t gonna get any info they might as well have killed her before she killed anyone 2. The Titans that breach the walls are still at large so they are no more safe than they were simply knowing Annie was the female titan

Aaron S.

Curtis don’t forget the OVAs, they are very important to watch for Season 2 -Ilse’s Notebook -No Regrets/Levi Backstory Part 1 & Part 2 These 3 OVAs are MUST watch. These are important for the story moving forward

Brother E

God you're so lucky you don't have to wait literally FOUR YEARS for the next episode. What they meant about "not getting anything" was more about the fact that they couldn't interrogate her in the end. So the operation to take her in alive instead of just outright trying to kill her (which would have certainly been at least a little bit easier) came up empty in the end. But you're correct in that they at least neutralized a dangerous threat, which I believe Erwin also pointed out as its own victory.

Tyler

Curtis, imagine having to wait years for the next season to come out after that cliff hanger!

There was no other way around it, Erwin made the best choice keeping the operation a secret. Next season will show you the MPs cannot be trusted at this point

WHOLESOME DEUS

I don’t even want to imagine what sort of titan Trump is gonna put in the walls

Gigamac24

now to wait 4 years for season 2....oh wait you don't have to :P

Plus, it's implied that he COULD've told the MP higher ups or Zackly, since he himself figured out that if anyone has been in the service for 5+ years, they're safe. But he decided to act with the SC alone so that they'd get most of the credit, and the SC's reputation would be reinvigorated. He decided to sacrificing hundreds of HIS OWN COUNTRY's civilians was worth it. What good soldier would EVER make such a decision? He had options. He chose to ignore them.

M9M5

Why did it take me this long to realize Erwin is Jotaro!!??

V_VMat

Curtis, you keep forgetting a simple fact. The enemy shifters don't kill people directly; they bust open the gates and let the Titans kill the people. The shifters that make that happen, the Armored and the Colossal, still haven't been found. They assume Annie knew, and with her captured but unable to extract any information from her, the Walls can still be breached, so in some sense, the loss of hundreds of civilian lives WERE meaningless. What's worse is that Erwin not only acted outside of his jurisdiction and authority, he himself set up the plan in the middle of a civilian city, when his job, as a soldier, is to protect people.

M9M5

wasn't it like 4 years?

V_VMat

I remember watching this cliff-hanger when AOT first came out and the wait between season 1 and 2 was brutal

TheMilkalator

Please Curtis, when there is so much text to read (I mean in those "transitions") you should pause and read it, because it's part of reaction and later there will be very important informations that will help you understand everything as whole.

Dertheaa

In a pragmatic sense it's a win for humanity of course because Eren is aligned w the human race. But in a more metaphorical/symbolic sense Jean is questioning whether it's really a win for humanity if they have to become monsters themselves. Neither approach/perspective on victory is necessarily correct and that's a common theme in AoT which is full of moral ambiguities like that

Tpoints

Yea, the inability to gain any info from Annie was a major letdown.

Spaz Boys Comedy

:-D

Spaz Boys Comedy

Maybe... For me, though, I don't really see what other methods would have actually secured Annie.

Spaz Boys Comedy

I didn't really get Jean's comment about Eren's destruction of the titans being a victory for humanity either tbh. The way I interpreted it is that if Eren threw away his humanity and became a monster to defeat the titans, it wouldn't be a victory for humanity because Eren would have to throw his humanity aside to win, it would be a victory for a monster not a human.

Tpoints

In the short term the operation was a success because it prevented further loss of life yes, but the main goal long term was to gain info from Annie. If they only wanted to prevent loss of life they would have just got Levi to go kill her outside of the walls instead of trying to capture her within them.

Tpoints

Look more carefully Curtis. Don't think that Titan wasn't looking through the wall. Pretty sure that Titan was INSIDE the wall itself.

Omar Cordova

Now I think personally that Erwin made all the right calls BUT I think the idea with the having nothing to show for Capturing Annie comes down to the fact that the titans that can break the walls are still there, effectively leaving them in the same eventual no win scenario anyway. They were also the ones who chose to engage Annie in the town. GRANTED, I think a big part of this story is the higher powers in the walls being unwilling to acknowledge their role in letting things getting so bad and basically forcing the Survey Corps to make the move they did. So I dont think their opinion is particularly that important but unfortunately dealing with complacent idiots is part of the Survey Corps job at this point.

Jordan Roehling

Also, there was no pardoning the Survey Corps by the government in the manga. That's just what they added here since this is where the season ends and they wanted it to end on a somewhat high note.

M9M5

Haven't read the early manga, is that the only major thing they change?(just say yes or no)

Gigamac24

Honestly, I prefer the manga version. In it, the Berzerk Titan thing never happened. Instead, Armin and Mikasa reach Eren at about the same time Annie starts climbing the wall. Then, Eren THROWS Mikasa towards the wall and she slices off Annie's fingers. While it's less of a rush, I prefer it for its thematic value and consistency, which is the fact that Eren's rage DOES NOT work in his favor. It's a big part of Eren's development, learning self-control, and this rage mode contradicts that.

M9M5

~Hey, fellas! Have you heard the news? You know that Annie's back in town. Won't take long just to watch and see all the fellas lay their money down.~

M9M5

I also agree with the military police commander. The problem is there could've been numerous other ways to try and seclud Annie without sacrificing the people there. And even if they managed to capture Annie they have no way of knowing if she's the only one of her kind and like the man questioning Erwin asked if it will actually help stall the enemy. A lot of Erwins decision making involves using people as bait on the off chance they might learn something new instead of prioritizing human lives. Not to say he's a bad character cause his decision making will make a lot more sense in the future

Ruben

It's been so long since I watched this for the first time, still get a good rush. I think one of my favourite, kinda underrated, moments has still got to be Erwin's unblinking stare even as the Titan hand slams right next to him. Such a badass.

Ashley King