A QUESTION FOR YOU PATRONS
Added 2017-04-04 18:15:56 +0000 UTCPatreon is very wonderful, and thanks to you guys we are making progress with all kinds of projects I just would not have had time for without your support.
THANK YOU!
By far the biggest undertaking of them all is "The Airship Pirate Chronicles". With a 15 person cast, and maybe 30 hours of total playback time, this has just been a HUGE undertaking, and I think its coming along amazingly.
But what do we do with it?
So far we are releasing it only on Patreon, just for you patrons who made it happen. But that feels...well...small. Each time I post chapters, I get maybe 4 comments from Patrons, and I have no way of seeing who's listening. So I have no idea if anyone is listening on not!
So my question is, should we release this for more then just Patreon Patrons?
For example, we could do this National Public Radio (N.P.R.) style:
Everybody gets it for free, and good people like yourself can support it. My only fear is, I don't want to piss of patrons like you, if you think its unfair for others to get it for free while you subscribe.
Another option is to sell it. We could sell the chapters in bundles as they come out.
Or...
What do you think? You guys are my top priority, and making you happy is what I care about most. But it does feel weird to be doing all this work, and have it heard by so few people.
Comments
Have you considered doing a delayed public release? Like, the patrons get it right away, as soon as it's available, then a week or two, or maybe a month, later, it becomes available to everyone. That way, you kinda get the best of both worlds: it can go to a wider audience, while still giving the patrons something non-patrons don't get, both as a thank-you, and to further encourage patronage. It also means that someone who might not have been interested enough in it to become a patron just so they could check it out, might hear the first few, and get interested enough that they decide to become a patron to keep them coming. For my own part, I know no mere description or cd box art would have gotten me interested enough in your music to have spent the money to be able to check it out, but the chain of events that led both to me being a patron, and to Abney Park being one of my favorite bands, got started because I came across recordings that were available for free on YouTube, thus allowing me to find out that your stuff was good, and to start supporting you, in that order.
Matthew Najmon
2017-05-06 20:33:47 +0000 UTCI think that it is good to put tid bits on Youtube, and if people want more, they can pay like we do here. It's good business and will get more people to help you guys.
Sandra Hould
2017-04-07 12:15:29 +0000 UTCI haven't had the chance to listen yet, hoping to have free time soon so i can do that, but i like the idea of having them go on sale a few days after it's been released to the patreon supporters. I have several friends who would enjoy it, but can't afford to be a regular patron.
Elizabeth Watts
2017-04-07 02:06:58 +0000 UTCI think that after they have been made available to us, then you should put them up for sale so everyone else has a chance to enjoy them as well.
Paul Pollard
2017-04-06 14:30:29 +0000 UTCWhile I specifically chose the "Audiobook level" when I found the patreon, I would neither reduce my level nor hold it against you if you made the audiobooks available to the public in which ever form you decide. My current preference actually would be "whichever option will allow you to continue producing the audiobook or ideally allow you to produce it faster" (yep, I'm hooked), so if publishing the episodes for free on youtube attracts some more people and we can hit the "four chapters per month" goal I'd be happy.
Jan Henning Peters
2017-04-06 14:02:10 +0000 UTCI chose the level not for the recording but for you guys. To support you and what you do. If you guys are putting so much work into this production you should be able to give it to the world how ever you feel is appropriate. I think there is alot of ways to support your patreons. Maybe when it is complete making sure they have access to the full free download, while other people purchase it. but honestly if you chose to give it away for free You would have my full support, I support the artist because i want them to create, not because i get something.
Joel Procell
2017-04-06 03:15:04 +0000 UTCAs an aspiring author, I believe that you should get paid for your work, hence why I'm a 'patron', I believe in your work and want to help you keep producing it. If you want to broadcast it like NPR, I don't have a problem with that, if you can sell it, even better. I think that perhaps having extras with the purchased product would be the best way to solve this situation. Those who listen free just get the story; those who pay for the right to keep it get not only the story but perhaps some extra like liner notes, etc.
George Woodruff
2017-04-05 20:45:23 +0000 UTCI also think that you should sell them, it is too good not to be shared with a broader audience! I like the idea of exclusive content of course, but if I can have them earlier than anyone on a regular basis and they are sold afterwards, it is "exclusive" enough form me :)
Calirohé
2017-04-05 16:41:47 +0000 UTCFor me it's enough that your work is being supported. No artist should starve, I say. I figure if sponsors get early access or don't pay or whatever that evens things out in my book.
Ayldruth Lyall
2017-04-05 16:07:27 +0000 UTCI think you should sell them! To me, the bonus is that I can listen to it for a bit of time before you release as a sale item.
Stephen Opipari
2017-04-05 13:41:26 +0000 UTCThank you, sincerely, for asking. The collective brilliance of Abney Park should be dispersed more; I will continue to support your endeavors regardless of profits made. Share the love…inspire a broader demographic! Words cannot express how grateful I am for the joy you all bring to my soulless government office cubicle; You guys really are an escape…from the timbre of a well sung chord to the aching end of a string…the work of Abney Park deserves the opportunity to influence a great many more lives, through song, print, epic adventures…I can’t wait to see what is next!
Rebecca Yarber
2017-04-05 05:26:29 +0000 UTCIt's a lot of work, and you should make money from it. I therefore also recommend releasing it in a sellable format such as audio CD. Sure, we're sending you some starter cash, but you're definitely worth a larger audience, who will line up for this.
Jonathan Coolidge
2017-04-05 04:32:02 +0000 UTCMy experience with being a Patron of other artists is that they strike a balance. Some stuff is Patron-exclusive, maybe 25%? and some stuff is paid but Patrons get it free or lower cost, maybe 50%? and the last 25% is stuff that would go out into the world for free anyway but Patrons get early access to it or maybe get a special version. Like if you did a video you might release that on YouTube for everyone but maybe Patrons get 48 hours of sneak peek then maybe we get a version with "director commentary" or an exclusive blooper video. That kind of thing. It's all about striking the balance you want around the content you're creating.
DrWex
2017-04-05 03:59:47 +0000 UTCHi guys!! OK.. first off, no regrets with Patreon... I picked this level for the audiobooks especially. Not a fan or releasing it for free for everyone, HOWEVER... as a "low cost" download after we have heard them all or even a proper CD release (it if would be profitable) seeing as you would have all the recordings already . LOVE LOVE LOVE the recordings, had forgotten after 50 years just how nice it is to have someone read to me :)
Lucy Holley
2017-04-05 02:38:38 +0000 UTCI chose the Patreon level that I did because I wanted the audiobook, so my first gut reaction is that it shouldn't be available for free. After reading this thread, I'm warming up a little to the idea of it being more widely available, maybe--as you've suggested--streaming only, with ads, on YouTube, and even then after a delay of at least a month. I've bought all your albums, and your books, so I've already got a lot of the free songs you've given away. Getting this exclusive thing makes my patronage, at the level I chose, feel special, if that makes sense. I'd definitely be more okay with you selling a complete version when each book is complete.
Andrew Kaplan
2017-04-05 01:47:01 +0000 UTCAs many others said, I think you should release them to the wider public. They are too awesome and too much effort went into them to not share. But I don't think it should be free, maybe very cheap and offer it as a whole book when each are finished?
Lisa Bollinger-Morgan
2017-04-05 01:30:24 +0000 UTCI love it! And I listen to the new chapters as you release them. I honestly think you should sell them as an audio book series. Sell each as you finish the book. It is going to be so much cooler than an audio book because you have a cast! But you could sell it as a download and/or CD's on your site release a teaser ! But you should definitely make money off of this project!
Lois Milare
2017-04-05 01:04:34 +0000 UTCI signed up to support you. Would love to hear the audiobook as well but would be delighted if you got it to a larger audience!
Mike Hart
2017-04-05 00:11:59 +0000 UTCWhen I first saw the "Serialized Audiobook of The Airship Pirate Chronicles" as a reward that sold me on contributing at at least that level. And I am happy to have gotten to hear what I have so far. Here's my thought: Keep the chapters coming and after the book is done collect them together and then share/sell them. That way those supporting on patreon get to hear the chapters before anyone else, but you can still do more with the work. Personally, I think it would make a great cd set - though obviously if you go with a physical medium, you'll need to charge for it. (I have no objection to charging for it in any case - you need to make a living.) If you do charge for it, my suggestion is to make the 1st chapter free to encourage people to buy the rest.
Chris
2017-04-04 23:47:14 +0000 UTCI always assumed these would be available more widely -- too big a production. If you can sell it then go for it; everyone's gotta live...
Lynne Everett
2017-04-04 22:34:46 +0000 UTCLike Jake Kale, I donate to support. The perks are an added bonus. I don't mind if you wish to share Patreon-only content with others, however I also think that people would be willing to pay for it. I certainly would! Xx
Sally
2017-04-04 22:25:01 +0000 UTCThe reason I donate isn't for the rewards really. I REALLY want to support you guys. Do want you want with them. I support a few podcasts that give away their product for free to the public. If you'd like to sell it, then do that instead. It's worth money, for sure.
TwistedTerrestrial
2017-04-04 22:13:43 +0000 UTCI signed up to support you guys. The stuff we get is incidental. That said, I am paying money for this stuff, and you have worked hard to produce it. Should not be free. Perhaps much lower price for much later release.
Hollis Curtis Perdan
2017-04-04 21:54:34 +0000 UTCI would be perfectly fine with the audiobook being released to the public for free. I've been there with the ones who can't afford even simple mp3 downloads, so I wouldn't mind sharing this story with others. Besides, I support you for the continuation of a great band and not because of the things it gets me here. But at the same time you have to look at the fact of what it costs you to produce this audiobook. Its a work of art, and as an artist myself I know that it's important to not let something go without a fair trade. I know for a fact that is hasn't been free to make, so money should be exchanged for others to hear it. However that doesn't mean that you have to charge a lot for it. Maybe release a digital sample for free. If that goes over well then offer the whole story as a digital or CD copy for a fee. Audio books can run anywhere from 15$ to 35$ so if you went to the lower end of that spectrum I feel like it would be fair to you and to others.
Whitney Hunt
2017-04-04 20:54:07 +0000 UTC..... first and then selling the products in whatever form you like.
Michelle CB
2017-04-04 20:44:54 +0000 UTCI support you because I love everything you do. I like the idea of let patrons having access to things for
Michelle CB
2017-04-04 20:44:10 +0000 UTCI agree with what's been said: early access rather than exclusive access for Patreon supporters would be perfectly acceptable. In fact, keeping it completely Patreon-only would make very little business sense. We want our goodies and to feel like we're getting our money's worth as backers, but more than that, we want you to be successful and keep doing the awesome work you do, on stage and off.
Matthew Cranston
2017-04-04 20:43:21 +0000 UTCI signed up because I like your music and want to support you, but chose my level because I wanted the audiobooks. Suddenly giving them for free without any strings attached would make my current level somewhat pointless, and though I would continue supporting, I might change the level. But like the ideas that have been mentioned, and you yourself have suggested, I agree that you could: -Patrons would get it first, free, streaming and download. I think an extra reason to subscribe could be some extras like the illustrations, and behind the scenes stuff like you had in the first batch. Maybe conversations and discussions you've had with the actors about the roles and the show. -Everyone else would get it a month later, streaming only on Youtube, with ads (yours and Google's, or other) and a message to join Patreon, and no extras.
Mirandur
2017-04-04 20:32:59 +0000 UTCNot to mention writting it!! Let us patreons have it as our reward for supporting you but by all means sell it in anyway shape or format to reap the rewards of your creativity which any artist so justly deserves.
William e. Fortier
2017-04-04 20:30:48 +0000 UTCI am also a book narrator that knows how much work recording a story takes let alone adding sound effects, music ,retakes and editing. Not to mention the t
William e. Fortier
2017-04-04 20:26:31 +0000 UTCCaptain:
William e. Fortier
2017-04-04 20:22:58 +0000 UTCThis is what I was going to suggest - release it here first for the patronage, and then later in a format that can make you some money (ad revenue isn't much, but it's more than nothing).
James Fellrath
2017-04-04 19:42:00 +0000 UTCI would say overall most people won't have issue with a Get it now, free upload later to streaming. It's a very common model across the board from Rooster Teeth, Geek and Sundry, and other larger podcasts. I won't be changing my level regardless, but I can understand the concern re a subscriber base. If you want to keep those in your good sights, maybe go with your Youtube Plan with a 2 week-1month delay. Can't imagine that being an issue for most, I think we are all here to support you first and acquire loot second ^_^
Matthew Winslow
2017-04-04 19:18:55 +0000 UTCI think it would be great to do an audio CD set of them. Maybe offer a discount code to Patreons so we get it a tad cheaper but it's a waste not to sell it to the masses.
Adrian Jones
2017-04-04 19:10:37 +0000 UTCRelease it. I'm a patron because I want to support your work; it doesn't take anything away from me if someone else gets to enjoy it too.
Jason Puckett
2017-04-04 19:10:01 +0000 UTCI assumed you were being "internet clever".
Abney Park
2017-04-04 19:08:43 +0000 UTCI'm all about the making of money, its just that its very unclear whats the right way to do that these days. For example, we just had a sale were I set all the album downloads at $2. Seems like we'd loose money, right? In fact, we made more money off that sale then we did releasing the last album! sometimes cheap, or free, actually makes the most.
Abney Park
2017-04-04 19:08:27 +0000 UTCLOL it converted my silent action into properly formatted HTML.
Donald Dienst
2017-04-04 19:07:28 +0000 UTCwow, looks like your fans want you to make more money then you do. <smerking grin=""></smerking>
Donald Dienst
2017-04-04 19:05:15 +0000 UTCI like the idea of selling it as a CD when finished. When the CD is done, you could put out a couple chapters on YouTube as teasers to get people interested in buying the CD.
David Dierks
2017-04-04 18:55:14 +0000 UTCYeah, I was thinking once you're finished, collect it on a CD, and sell it to the public. For one thing, it means we get early access and can listen and offer advice if warranted (sort of 'editing'), and then when you're completely happy with the result, you can sell it on your website. :)
ShintoNephilim
2017-04-04 18:50:29 +0000 UTCHow about this: patrons get it first, free, steaming and download. Everyone else gets it: with ads, streaming only, on YouTube. That way there is motivation to subscribe, but also a way to listen and get hooked without subscribing.
Abney Park
2017-04-04 18:46:23 +0000 UTCOnce the chapters are complete sell it as an audio book
Robert Boesen
2017-04-04 18:41:13 +0000 UTCWon't bother me if you release it/podcast it doesn't free, but do consider selling it! Maybe release it here first (incentive for patrons), then release on a podcast schedule, and give the option to buy it all in one lump? That's what another group I follow does.
Liz
2017-04-04 18:36:10 +0000 UTCI like the idea of an audio book once the patron releases are over, that way it can reach a wider audience.
Karen Woblick
2017-04-04 18:33:29 +0000 UTCI am ok with whatever you want to do but my vote is when it is complete release it as an audio book on Audible for a nominal price. There are so few fully dramatized audio books.
Donald Dienst
2017-04-04 18:29:26 +0000 UTCI'd go with the selling idea - this way you give people the choice, whether they want to support you continously (as we do) or punctually (by buying stuff).
Quork Q'Tar
2017-04-04 18:28:11 +0000 UTCI'd say public after a delay (like above), either for sale or in the NPR style. Could garner more patrons that way maybe.
Victor Kivisto
2017-04-04 18:26:26 +0000 UTCI 2nd this idea, and would totally buy it 8]
eric hughes
2017-04-04 18:25:02 +0000 UTCI second the idea of making the audio chapters public a month or two after we get them. That way your supporters get their perks, and it's still accessible to the general fandom.
Giselle Feuillet
2017-04-04 18:23:02 +0000 UTCI love listening to it and have no problem with you releasing it the world. One option is to release it to Patreon subscribers a month earlier than the general public.
Sharyn Cyreth
2017-04-04 18:21:50 +0000 UTCI listen to every chapter, I just forget to log in and comment. You could try giving non subscribers a teaser and if they like it suggest subscribing or offering discounted rate every 5 chapters. I sounds amazing in my car, it has made my kids want to read the books and listen to your albums.
Candie Kohler
2017-04-04 18:21:29 +0000 UTCMaybe even have it release a week early for patrons as well.
Jeroen Heijster (MoonRaven)
2017-04-04 18:20:56 +0000 UTCI am not a high enough patron to get it, so I haven't heard it, so obviously I'd love access to it in some capacity! You could always eventually box it up and sell it as a CD set- audiobooks are a huge market right now and some of them are full-cast reenactments, so that would fit right in.
Jeff Gilbert
2017-04-04 18:20:20 +0000 UTCOoo, good idea. If we put a "please subscribe" ad at the end of the free version, maybe that'll just be annoying enough to be a benefit subscribers. We could also allow streaming for free, but downloads are only for subscribers.
Abney Park
2017-04-04 18:19:26 +0000 UTCPersonally I think it would be awesome to release it to the world for free. If it ends up that too many people would get upset over it being free, there could be something else thought up to replace it in the patron rewards
Raine Oberlin
2017-04-04 18:19:13 +0000 UTCI think sell it. I'm happy to have given you the chance to produce it with my support. And it feels like a bonus to get early access.
Lora Friedenthal
2017-04-04 18:18:43 +0000 UTCWe'd still get an ad-free version and you can spread it more which may gain more patrons.
Jeroen Heijster (MoonRaven)
2017-04-04 18:18:37 +0000 UTCI don't mind having it open to the public. Throw in a pre and post ad and you can earn something off it as well.
Jeroen Heijster (MoonRaven)
2017-04-04 18:18:00 +0000 UTC
